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Discussion Starter · #21 ·
Pipe blacking up nicely… it’s jetted perfect for the normal going but for the mrs going about the soft stuff in first/second it needs richening up all round… but there’s also a fine line between crisp jetting and a blubbering mess on the little bikes.

That’s why I was trying to tag [mention]ktm808 [/mention]

It’s running this…



I don’t want to go to this… she’s not riding it like MX WOT to make it work…



Think I’ll try going a step up though… either 42, N1EI and either 182 Clip 4, or 185 Clip 3… still need to be giving it some though.

I had a go up and down the main trail into the riding area, pinned in fourth, feathering the clutch, floating… thing singing with my 87kg frame on it. Came back grinning like Clarkson on Top Gear.

Not as easy as a 250/4 but she’ll be a better rider for it.

Spot the four stroke quad rider though… no amount of belligerence was going to move this. I couldn’t even drag it out, half dug then I got it out clutching it.


 

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Get the jetting right and it’s too rich to mince but then when your on it, the bike won’t bite, even on slick surfaces, they love a spinning wheel/slipping clutch. It’s then a timing thing. You aim, fire, brake, turn, aim, repeat. It’s a brilliant feeling. I’m beginning to get there on the 250 at times now. When I get the right feeling and the timing of things works, it melts my brains how fast it covers the ground in a very effortless way. The issue I have is fitness and riding hours. I need more of both!

I’d rather lick my sump plug clean than ride the 4t! Arguably easier to ride and less tiring but they make a stupid noise and to much of it. I’d still take the 150 over the 4t.

Still can’t bring myself to sell the husky crack whore. I think it’ll get a spruce up. Cone valves back in it and keep it for tight wet events.
 

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Discussion Starter · #23 ·
Aye, that’s my concern… my 300 was like that with the Keihin, it ran best at the bottom right of the jetting chart with the NEDH/172 combo, sharp, not boggy… one jet/needle under and it was boggy to the point of losing momentum in the mid transition.

Maybe forgo a piston and jet it richer when she’s a bit more keen with the throttle…

Showed her how to two stank the clutch today… doesn’t need to do that in the big RFS quad… I had a flew loops around on the pipe to show her, it flies.

Deffo though, the 250/4 would’ve been easier to ride but they change hands at the track so they don’t come up often. Small smoker is better training and when it’s on the pipe floating, there’s no better feeling. Even the 300/2 in the desert with the SXS CDI, etc, etc… when it’s not going well, it’s stiff, it’s aggressive, evil thing… when it’s working, you float, it sings.

Four stroke feels like cheating. Fast but boring.
 

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Miner, the cc forks are so simple to work on yourself with basic tools - you'll be happy you've got them next time you have worn out seals! No more paying someone else Bob
 

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Discussion Starter · #25 ·
What’s your thoughts on jetting Bob? How much do you jet your 125’s up for sandy tracks compared to what it recommends? Fine line between rich for cooling and unrideable on the little bikes.
 

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I’ve little experience of mains on sand, hopefully Bob can chime in there. Don’t forget you have the NOZ needles to. Exactly the same but half a clip leaner. Handy for fine tuning. Your good lady might even like Suzuki NECJ/W if she’s not wanting to rag it mx style? Better for slower opening throttles and smooth operation.
 

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Hi, sea level on sand we were always over 200 main in the 125s, generally 205. The 150s are well known for needing a main richer than the charts. That gives you plenty of chances to come down sizes!
 

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Have you tried any shims under the needle?
 

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Discussion Starter · #29 ·
Hi, sea level on sand we were always over 200 main in the 125s, generally 205. The 150s are well known for needing a main richer than the charts. That gives you plenty of chances to come down sizes!
Interesting point Bob, wasn’t aware of that… got an N1EI needle there and a 185 main (180 in it now, waiting on a 182, 188 and 202 coming along with a N1EH needle)… might bang the 185 main in, see how it goes.

What about pilots? Better to keep it clean off the bottom so it doesn’t bog early and snap to life later?
 

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Discussion Starter · #30 ·
Have you tried any shims under the needle?
Not at that level yet… still chainsawing through the soft stuff WOT in second. More concerned about not melting the new piston too early.

It runs ok on the pipe, I was giving it some yesterday.
 

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Discussion Starter · #31 ·
Tried putting the 185 main in it to see how it would run… great 1/2-WOT and on the pipe but not clearing out until 1/2 throttle, bogging easy. Will put the N1EI and 182 in when they arrive, see how they are, still ok with the 40 pilot.


Not looking for perfection, just something that will pull clean and not melt the motor when getting screamed in 2nd through the soft stuff by novice two stroker / two wheeler.

To run the things on 45/N1EH/202 for sand, they must be screaming all the time… waaaaappp!
 

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Nice bike Miner, missus will love it.

Smaller carb = bigger jets? Or smaller jets?
Smaller.

N1Ex needles are known for being problematic down low due to their short straight sector. Fast riders won't see the problem as they open the throttle quickly and never are in that zero to 1/4 throttle range where the N1Ex are very rich. especially the N1EF is a pain, it is also the standard needle on my 300 Gasser and it gave me such a hard time.
But if it works why not.

Sand riding requires bigger jets but your wife probably will not need the same big main jets except she rides aggressive. I mentioned that as I jetted the bike of a 16 year old boy, the lad of me mate. He is brilliant and fast as hell and also rides in sand a lot. When he got a new bike his sister (15) took over his bike and for her it was too rich though she isn't slow. But she rides much more with lower throttle openings and opens the throttle slower, less aggressive. As expected she complained about a blubbery behavior down low so we went leaner and now she's happy. I mention this cause you might jet the bike for yourself and then hear the missus complaining ;-)
 
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Discussion Starter · #33 ·
Thanks Steveman, good feedback… and yes, I could ride it ok as I was able to jump on it, get it on the pipe and keep it 1/2-WOT. It did bog quick, you had to be quick with the clutch or the shifter, most effective was clutching it and snapping it open. I had the thing singing in 4th, felt more powerful with the bigger jet in but it wasn’t for ticking open. Exactly like you said.

It was running fine on 40, N1EJ, 180, zinged well, I had it zinging then too… a different enjoyment to the 300. Great fun.

On [mention]Pindie [/mention]point about the N0Zx needles… I’ll check the jetting charts for the others and see what I’ve got that’s similar. Could be something there to try for tickling it open.

Enjoy riding the 300 with the Lectron but also enjoying fiddling with jetting again. Still got the feel.
 

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If it’s happy on 185 1/2 to wot then keep it there. My te loves 182. Any less it’s zingy. Any more and gurgle mess. 42 pilot, possibly 45. All using a decent RK Tek head which helps a lot

the older 150s had a good reputation for meltdown. Keep it wet and cool!

N1EF is my needle of choice in the 150. Clip 4. Very rich but for me it works. In a 300 it would not. Beta 250 is on NOZG 4. Im not sure why I can get away with much richer settings than other. I don’t think a novice would be able to use my setting? I’m not fast or aggressive but I seem to twist a fair bit. Using clip 4 works on hills/load well but can be a tad rich anywhere else. You have a big fat torque reserve under load that you simply don’t get on leaner clips.
 

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Discussion Starter · #35 ·
Just read some old posts I’d googled about 150SX’s melting… think I’ll keep the 185 with the N1EI when it lands. See how it runs, might try the 182 as well then the 42 pilot, shame it’s not as accessible.

Also saw something [mention]steveman [/mention]had queried about iridium plugs? That a thing or an old wife’s tale? Just stuck a fresh one it for plug chops.

 

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The iridium sparks just seem to handle overly rich mixtures better and live longer. If it is worth the 5 times higher price of a standard plug you need to find out yourself.
In US forums I have a bad reputation as plug chop hater. In my opinion they are useless, but I do not want to bother you nor do I want to discuss that over and over again ;-)
 
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Discussion Starter · #37 ·
Aye… when I say plug chop, I’m going to try it with the jetting I pick with two combos (I’ve got two new plugs) pull them and check them. Just looking for an indication of how it is besides how it feels.

I’ve run iridium plugs in all the bikes (tarmac/track, enduro, trials, desert/MX) and never had any issues. They are less prone to fouling up, the bike fouled up and wouldn’t start after the mrs bogged it down with the 185 main. Made me suspicious about the plug… turns out they didn’t stick the new plugs I sent up with the linkage. No drama, just changed it. Old plug looks original and was worn to about 0.8mm, gapped both iridium ones for 0.6mm and stuck one in.

Did also accidentally put 1.5L worth of oil in for the 1.5L of 60:1 mix I put in from the other fuel can… wouldn’t have helped, only 9ml out.
 

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Discussion Starter · #38 ·
Interesting little things to jet these… tried the N1EI needle on clip 3 with the 185 main, was ok. Not zingy but didn’t burble like the N1EJ on clip 3 before clearing out. More of a rich feel before coming on the power with a boom… bwaaahhh; boom! Off it goes!

Tried the 42 pilot in it, it’s a little rich but Plan A was scuppered by a seized air screw went straight for the 42 rather than try the air screw. Appears to be seized around two turns checking out the 36PWK I took off my same year 300. Runs ok though.

The stock jetting that was in it suited nicely for the ambient temperature, crisp, zingy, rides well… but possibly lean up top like you guys said.

42(2), N1EI(3), 185 in it is two steps rich according to the manual tables… according to the app I came across from the guys here, it’s about right (bearing in mind it was 10’C hotter when I run it at ~1500hrs today). Much the same as the above little rich but takes off and pulls ok, feels fatter, comes on the pipe and it flies. Roll off/on, feels a bit rich but crack it open and it flies on the pipe. Quick flick of the clutch and it takes off.

Unlike the enduro which gets rich and doesn’t like it, this thing feels like the more fuel you chuck in it and hold it open, the stronger it gets. Feels stronger with the bigger jet, the 180 for the temp in the manual is maybe a step lean?

For sand running 45, N1EH(4), 202 the thing must just be snapped open all the time… will try it one day I’ve got some spare time. See what it’s like to ride.

Temps now low 20’s to low 30’s here and coming down a little still, will stop at low to mid 20’s in the daytime. Keen to keep it a little richer on the pilot to give it more fuel on the overrun when the mrs shuts it off after horsing it in the low gears through the softer stuff.



 

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My feelings on a small bore is you have to suffer some slight throttle richness in order to have a depth of torque/power when you let it fly. You need to ride carrying far more momentum than bigger bikes and then join the dots from point to point on full beans and have faith it’s going there. I’m thinking this is the good lessons a small bore teaches you. On the beta 250 now, sometimes I feel impossibly slow into a turn but the reality is you need to hold that momentum to stop flopping over and get the power back on early to get a long and clean drive. Then it’s just stupid fast on any straight. Try and do it 150 stylee and it’s much slower and you will crash as the weight shoves you about at the wrong part of the corner.
 

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Discussion Starter · #40 ·
My feelings on a small bore is you have to suffer some slight throttle richness in order to have a depth of torque/power when you let it fly.
That would be an accurate description of what I felt when I had it on the scrub last night trying out the jetting, flatter but fuller on the pipe. Stab the clutch and off you go.

Very much a characteristic of the motor also… I think tweaking the power valve to open later would make it worse and trickier to jet. Less airflow, more fluff before it comes on the pipe.

FMF Fatty & Shorty combo looks appealing, pipe looks a little fatter in the first section and the shorter silencer will give it some extra bark off the bottom.

Mrs is used to riding a 525 RFS, it’ll be a good learning experience for her, learn to use the clutch properly and get her speed up. If you can ride these, you can ride anything.

Making me want a smaller smoker for the track… 300EXC with the SXS CDI is a handful.
 
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